Feathercoin daemon and wallet production version 0.19.1
Old daemon and wallet version 0.18.3

Difficulty Discussion - Fork Update - Bushstar


  • Regular Member | Tip ghostlander

    [quote name=“Bushstar” post=“2230” timestamp=“1368203680”]
    One proposal is a difficulty adjust every 504 blocks and at a difference of 40% maximum.
    [/quote]

    That’s better than what we have now. People are losing faith in FTC and sell it at ridicuosly low prices. Transactions take long to get confirmed, 51% attack threat, etc. Some kind of averaging window may also be implemented, but it needs more testing to justify. For instance, to retarget every 504 blocks or even less, but to calculate geometric average over 2016 blocks.


  • Regular Member | Tip zerodrama

    We need to explicitly distinguish between normal and abnormal situations. 2016 is indeed useless. The web is a different beast from 4 years ago, speed wise, content wise, threat wise, culture. 2016 should simply be a reference point.

    I think restricting difficulty rise can create a different problem, pump and dump galore.

    We should use a moving average over 2016 blocks sampled every 504. We could as a rule accept a range of difficulty and also have a minimum and maximum reward.

    But again. Low difficulty was an unfortunate mistake. Nevertheless, perhaps this is a soft DDoS attack and should be dealt with as such.

    I still think the extremes should be dealt with in a different way. If the difficulty seems to be going too high, keep the earlier difficulty and drop the reward to preserve confirmation speed. If the difficulty seems to be dropping too fast, keep it higher and increase the reward.

    Also another thing: The only way this kind of attack is even possible is because 1) there is an opportunity to cause price crashes through massive processing power and 2) when price drops the attackers can buy more and increase their gains round after round.

    Therefore I would suggest maybe we need to cause coins to spread out more when these attacks occur. More decentralization. I would suggest requiring a higher difficulty for larger amounts.

    So mainly I think there should be two modes of operation: normal mode - no change in behavior, evasive action mode - apply changes.

    It may be possible to achieve much of this without a fork.


  • Regular Member | Tip Markus1337

    sorry guys to ask such noob questions but what is 51% attack exactly? Is it when a pool has over 51% total hash power and then changes some setting? I donno does it work like a DDoS?


  • Regular Member | Tip Nutnut

    [quote name=“Markus1337” post=“2423” timestamp=“1368259683”]
    sorry guys to ask such noob questions but what is 51% attack exactly? Is it when a pool has over 51% total hash power and then changes some setting? I donno does it work like a DDoS?
    [/quote]

    I [i]think[/i] if any one person (wallet) has more than 50% they effectively have control over the block chain which means they can undo transactions, double spend etc. They would have to have malicious intent though so just because someone has 51% doesn’t mean it will all go to brown stuff.

    Anyone more educated than i care to elaborate?


  • | Tip Bushstar

    In a 51% attack someone can generate their own block chain and force it on to the network. The idea is that you would generate this chain but not broadcast it until you had gone around and spent your money on goods. Then you broadcast your chain without those transactions present. Generally these attacks fail and just leave orphaned block chains behind.

    Back to business.

    To me it looks like we should not just wait on this like Freicoin did.

    The best option is to go for a four times faster difficulty adjust but with a much less variable adjust. This means when the difficulty comes down it will only do so by 40% which will not bring all the miners running but will be enough to entice some back. This will stop us from turning into bubble coin.

    I have made some basic changes and am getting some peer review. I will come back here to let you all know the details when I have them.


  • | Tip UKMark

    Great news bush! In the meantime, I’m stocking up on cheap coins. 🙂

    A 51% attack is usually what is bantered about by people who don’t really understand the complexity in successfully pulling one off, in fact usually by people who would actually struggle [i]pulling one off[/i] [citation needed] 😃


  • Regular Member | Tip Nutnut

    [quote name=“UKMark” post=“2449” timestamp=“1368264525”]
    A 51% attack is usually what is bantered about by people who don’t really understand the complexity in successfully pulling one off, in fact usually by people who would actually struggle [i]pulling one off[/i] [citation needed] 😃
    [/quote] 😉


  • | Tip archminer

    Great news bush! Looking forward for this getting pushed out.


  • | Tip ShadowEW

    Sounds good to me, and if I’m reading into it correctly then it should change difficulty 4x as fast, but won’t ever rise or fall 40% more than current. Even two ‘fast’ round would only raise it; (start+40%)+40% which makes it a 106% overall maximum rise from the first round to third. Albeing my math is correct.

    But I am curious of one thing, if it’s forked what will the difficulty of the first 504 blocks be?


  • | Tip Bushstar

    The current difficulty would stay the same so we would have to keep pushing through it to get 504 block from the last difficulty adjust. At that point the difficulty will drop 40%. That will make it roughly as profitable to mine as Bitcoin. It will not bring the miners back that only chase the most profitable coins.

    Those like myself who support Feathercoin can continue mining the coins with the lowered difficulty and see the rewards. The smaller adjust stops us from being hopped on and then abandoned. I’ve used Freicoin as an example of a coin that went through this. It recently was the most popular to mine and has now been left very unprofitable and will face a very long wait to get back.

    We do not want to continue with a problem that could come back in the future. Like Litecoin had to be faster than Bitcoin we have to be faster than Litecoin.


  • Regular Member | Tip Nutnut

    So next re-target at 32760? 100 blocks away?

    By my estimation at the current hash rate that’s nearly 3 days? :o

    Or have i got it all wrong?


  • | Tip Bushstar

    Remember that the hard fork means that everyone has to update their client, this includes pool and services. Three days is not a great deal of time to get everyone to prepare properly for a hard fork.


  • Regular Member | Tip Nutnut

    Fair enough. So what are you doing now to announce/promote the fork?

    I can hold out for a while longer but i would be greatly reassured if I see you announce something official not only to the community here but across bitcointalk etc.


  • Regular Member | Tip aysyr

    [quote name=“UKMark” post=“2449” timestamp=“1368264525”]
    Great news bush! In the meantime, I’m stocking up on cheap coins. 🙂

    A 51% attack is usually what is bantered about by people who don’t really understand the complexity in successfully pulling one off, in fact usually by people who would actually struggle [i]pulling one off[/i] [citation needed] 😃
    [/quote]

    Nice! Bought some myself last night at the bottom of that valley 🙂


  • | Tip Bushstar

    [quote name=“Nutnut” post=“2532” timestamp=“1368281144”]
    Fair enough. So what are you doing now to announce/promote the fork?

    I can hold out for a while longer but i would be greatly reassured if I see you announce something official not only to the community here but across bitcointalk etc.
    [/quote]

    As soon as I can I will announce the update version across the forums and contact all pools and services to update their daemons. We have to engage with everyone to make this as seamless a transition as possible.


  • Regular Member | Tip svennand

    Sweet im ready! :o


  • | Tip WeTradeCoins

    [quote name=“Bushstar” post=“2538” timestamp=“1368282210”]
    [quote author=Nutnut link=topic=363.msg2532#msg2532 date=1368281144]
    Fair enough. So what are you doing now to announce/promote the fork?

    I can hold out for a while longer but i would be greatly reassured if I see you announce something official not only to the community here but across bitcointalk etc.
    [/quote]

    As soon as I can I will announce the update version across the forums and contact all pools and services to update their daemons. We have to engage with everyone to make this as seamless a transition as possible.
    [/quote]

    WeMineFTC.com is ready to upgrade w/e you want 🙂 Just letus know 🙂


  • Regular Member | Tip zerodrama

    I’ll upgrade as well. I have a feeling litecoin is about to get the same treatment. The price will drop if it stays below BTC profitability for too long.

    Bushstar, can you move the difficulty code into a library? It would make it much easier for people to upgrade.


  • | Tip Tuck Fheman

    [b]Here’s how Freicoin is handling it …[/b]

    [url=https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=202250.0]https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=202250.0[/url]

    Freicoin - Difficulty Adjustment Algorithm updated [HARD-FORK @ block #28476]

    • Add the new difficulty adjustment algorithm, which replaces the simple
      average over 2016 blocks with a faster-acting 144-tap Parks and
      McClellan FIR filter, and adjustments every 9 blocks with a gain of
      0.1025 and limiter of 1.055.

    • Prepare for deployment of difficulty adjustment filter to production
      network by adding a threshold block after which the new difficulty
      adjustment algorithm takes over, for both mainnet and testnet.

    • Added Python simulator of new difficulty adjustment algorithm.

    • Fixed two related bugs in the freicoin “accounts” system. First, the
      ‘move’ RPC command now generates AccountingEntry records with the
      current reference height rather than refheight=0. Second, the
      ‘listaccounts’ RPC command properly time-value adjusts AccountingEntry
      records.

    • Fix unwanted transaction de-prioritization. Now calculates both inputs
      and outputs of a transaction based on the transaction’s reference
      height, as opposed to the current block height, which was previously
      being used for the inputs. This was resulting in smaller (or even
      negative) fees for the purposes of priority calculation, thereby
      resulting in transactions that had trouble getting on the block chain.

    • Change nVersion on Freicoin Foundation addresses to testnet format, so
      that budgets validate correctly. This enables mining on testnet.

    • Modified output of ‘getblocktemplate’ RPC command to include a ‘budget’
      array specifying budgetary requirements.


  • | Tip archminer

    Block 32760 is only 66 blocks away, any update on when the new version will be released?


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